S
Senile Old Fart
chevman, I do not think Shine was referring to you, I think it was more about an "expert" on another site.
57 Chevy Nomad
- Thread starter chevman
- Start date
S
Senile Old Fart
shine;12787 said:
chevman;12788 said:
shine;12789 said:
chevman;12740 said:
History
Thanks Strum
Shine, I would like very much to be able to use epoxy for blocking, but we will see how it goes. Although in the pictures it looks straight, but a closer look will reveal small low spots, that I had planed on covering with 2K primer. If a shrinking disc was used and it worked perfectly, then maybe most of it would be flat. Of course those low spots can be removed, but you have to draw a line somewhere, so there will be a small amount of filler used.
Shine, I would like very much to be able to use epoxy for blocking, but we will see how it goes. Although in the pictures it looks straight, but a closer look will reveal small low spots, that I had planed on covering with 2K primer. If a shrinking disc was used and it worked perfectly, then maybe most of it would be flat. Of course those low spots can be removed, but you have to draw a line somewhere, so there will be a small amount of filler used.
metalman
Oldtimer
chevman;12774 said:
No need to go to red heat with the shrinking disc. Only about 400 degrees is needed to shrink the steel sheet. The water is only used to check the results quickly and repeated applications will not make the metal brittle. Small high spots can occasionally get to blued (higher) heat with the disc but one of the benifits of shrinking with the disc is it puts the heat into what needs it, the high spots.
You actually put more heat into the metal with the stud gun though in a small concentrated area.
I say whatever works for you is right and you are for sure getting excellent results.
metalman;12819 said:
This reminds me of when I purchased a stud gun. I was going to use it for places with limited access to the back and I wanted the best one, so I got the pro. When I started using it for shrinking, there were problems with the trigger, so I called the manufacturer. Once she found out what I was doing, she said "you have the wrong gun for that". The difference between the guns is that the pro has 50% more power. After getting the economy gun, I found that a slight flick of the trigger would shrink a very small spot and you can't even feel the heat on the panel, it just amazes me how it works.
metalman
Oldtimer
Makes sense that the power could vary between different brands or models.
Your story reminded me of the horrible method an old timmer showed me many years ago (Nixon was pres.). He would heat an area about the size of a quarter cherry red, and as quick as posible back it up with a dollie and beat the tar out it around the edge of the red spot. Then cool it with a water soaked rag, repeat! Claimed it pushed the metal to the center of the heat spot therefore shrinking it, it did, but talk about trama to the metal
! That guy used lots of plastic filler. Hope I never unearth any of that stuff. Being new at the time I thought it was cool, did it and didn't know any better.
A few years later I worked with a good body man that was very good at shrinking with very small quick touches with the torch and he straightened me out on that. In those days no one ever heard of a shrinking disc, the stud gun was yet to be invented and MIG welders were unheard of and when they (MIG) did start showing up I though it was something the Russians used to put their fighter planes together.
Your work looks top shelf and you definietly have a handle on the process. Please post more photos as the job progresses.
Your story reminded me of the horrible method an old timmer showed me many years ago (Nixon was pres.). He would heat an area about the size of a quarter cherry red, and as quick as posible back it up with a dollie and beat the tar out it around the edge of the red spot. Then cool it with a water soaked rag, repeat! Claimed it pushed the metal to the center of the heat spot therefore shrinking it, it did, but talk about trama to the metal
! That guy used lots of plastic filler. Hope I never unearth any of that stuff. Being new at the time I thought it was cool, did it and didn't know any better.A few years later I worked with a good body man that was very good at shrinking with very small quick touches with the torch and he straightened me out on that. In those days no one ever heard of a shrinking disc, the stud gun was yet to be invented and MIG welders were unheard of and when they (MIG) did start showing up I though it was something the Russians used to put their fighter planes together
.Your work looks top shelf and you definietly have a handle on the process. Please post more photos as the job progresses.
shine
Member
i have a hood from my 54 ford truck that is so hammered and beat up i dont think it would ever be right. the crease in the middle is butchered . it has been on fire. been hammered to death. i would have to get the whole hood cherry red . running it through a ewheel would be the only hope .
'68 Coronet R/T
Oldtimer
metalman;12856 said:. . . He would heat an area about the size of a quarter cherry red, and as quick as posible back it up with a dollie and beat the tar out it around the edge of the red spot. Then cool it with a water soaked rag, repeat! Claimed it pushed the metal to the center of the heat spot therefore shrinking it, it did, but talk about trama to the metal
Hmmm, I was taught that method about 3 years ago while taking an auto body and paint class as an alternative to using the stud gun. Used the torch and a metal shrinking hammer and dolly employing the hammer strike toward the center method followed by the wet rag.
It definitely shrunk the metal up but I still preferred the stud gun and air hose.
My next project will be one to learn some metal working skills on.
metalman
Oldtimer
Those serrated "metal shrinking hammer" causes even more damage to the metal.
It all works to get panels shrunk when needed and close enough for a reasonable amount of filler to finish.
The discussion I think is the difference between general body work and fine finished metal that requires very little or no filler. The time involved in metal shaping / finishing usually excludes it from general production body repair. Can't put a time estimate on it. I suppose it depends on each situation, the access to the back of the damage, the extent of the damage (like Shine's hood), etc.
It all works to get panels shrunk when needed and close enough for a reasonable amount of filler to finish.
The discussion I think is the difference between general body work and fine finished metal that requires very little or no filler. The time involved in metal shaping / finishing usually excludes it from general production body repair. Can't put a time estimate on it. I suppose it depends on each situation, the access to the back of the damage, the extent of the damage (like Shine's hood
), etc.
shine
Member
i talked with a guy a couple of years ago that was doing a 57 ht. his own car . he was doing an excellent job on it. he had kept track of the hours he had into it. metal work alone he had over 800 hours in it. now at 50 and hour that is 40 grand . so the guy like me that does this for a living can not take it that far . this is why the extremely nice one's cost 100k+ to restore . there was a black truck at bj this year that had 7000+ hours in it. most of the cars i do come in at around 1000 hours total for the build. this is why i turn down really rough cars. no way will they spend the money and i don't need the practice. there is nothing wrong with filler if done right. it is a necessity sometimes. if i was as talented as randy it would be different . but it would just take me too many hours to get it done.
this is Inderweed . it is mine and god only knows how many hours i will have in it when done . lot of metal work ahead of me.
this is Inderweed . it is mine and god only knows how many hours i will have in it when done . lot of metal work ahead of me.
danp76
Oldtimer
I agree Shine, I'm currently doing a 56 chevy convertilbe and have around 500 hrs into it so far. I agree with you, if body filler is applied properly it will last for years. In fact, a panel is typically repainted as a result of a scratch or ding and not the filler failing. I have blasted panels and the body filler is on them like glue, and these are panels that were painted years ago with old filler from years ago, todays fillers are even better. So why kill yourself on the metal work? There was no epoxy primer to go over then, and the body filler still stuck on the panel very well...makes me wonder?