Universal clear over Kirker/LDS

crashtech;3210 said:
It might be helpful for you to post links to the product description sheets for all the materials you have in your possession.
Click to expand...

As long as I'm straying from mainstream products my plans are the same as yours - test panels. Good call. As for tech sheets, SPI is going under AND over and those sheets should be familiar enough (or I can post if needed). The only question is what's going between SPI. I have less Kirker left than I thought so I just may be finding another BC to use, hence, the question above about MS products. That jobber tries to be helpful, but he's not always accurate so I need to know what I need to know before I approach him.

The only line they have that suits my budget/needs is Crossfire, and it uses no activator in BC form. Is that anything worth even considering?
 
TEC/BASE is the only Martin Senour product worth considering.

Honestly, if you are considering an alternative base coat at this point, a higher quality product is really not much more in the big scheme of things, not to mention fewer headaches and a much improved probability of success. High quality base coats cover in fewer coats and can use SPI reducer. In many instances the more expensive base coat turns out to be more economical.

Have you priced Pro-Spray? Chad.S on here is a jobber for them. Do us all a favor and PM him before you buy any more paint!!!

P.S. Here's a link to Chad's website:

http://www.autorodtechnologies.com/
 
What color are you looking at spraying, as crash said a better base will cover in fewer coats, and the reason i'm asking color is that some colors will get really good coverage in just a few coats. While other colors take more.
 
Color and quality does make a big difference in the coverage. I am in the process of painting a 1973 Mustang with Pro Spray that I got from Chad. The color is Performance Red and was kind of pricey for a non-metalic base, but covered the white SPI epoxy sealer in just 2 coats and just over 2 qts of base. The last Stang that I did was a 67 that was done with Chromabase in Acapulco Blue. That car took 3 full coats and was over 3 qts of base.

If your painting experience is limited, spend the money on a quality base, and cover it with SPI clear. It will definately be worth the money. The more you have to spray, the more chances of mistakes to screw things up.

Aaron
 
Kmatch,

To be clear (no pun intended) The universal will go over your stuff as well as theirs, I would make sure the color is activated like it should be and wait over night.
You can call me anytime, of course.
 
I hope not, these are very tough threads to answer and this is where the problem comes in on any forum like this.

He pointed out, he did not want an arm chair response from someone that did not use it, so he got a little mad at Shine.

Problem comes in when a professional painter answers something like this is they know the reputation of all the brands whether they have used the brand or not, they learn these facts from their jobber salesman or other painters and shops they know.
The other issue is, painters are looking at the long term results and not the short term and to a lot of people not in this business, red is red and green is green and of course price is the big difference.

To compare, take a mechanic, he knows not to use a fram oil filter, yet they have some great advertising, so the customer knows the name fram but don't know what a wix is as no real need for Wix to advertise to the do it your self market.

This is also why you see very few painters stick around most general paint forums for long, as the frustration, over the pors, rust converters and low grade paints, do take there toll.

Hard to explain and harder to understand.

Overall, I think he got a more civilized answer and and a better answer here then he could of, on most forums and I would like to thank you all for that.
 
when 50 dollars worth of cheap paint is more important than the quality of the job on their car i do get frustrated. 19 dollar paint guns and cheap internet paint . it shows disrespect for the ones who do this for a living every day. i visit those other paint forums but never post. it is absolutely amazing what kind of advice you see. but then i have hired those same idiots time after time over the years. some will never make it past lot car work .
i will no longer post on a thread where i do not recognize the poster. it is a waste of time. they do not want the right answer, they will ask the same question on every board until they find someone to agree with them. i think my days on the net are numbered .

and for the record . there are not many brands of paint i have not used over the years. reps give the stuff away trying to get you to switch.
i do not have to load acme into my gun to know it is junk. and i would use jd blitz before using kirker.
 
I haven't gone away! LOL! And THANK YOU to all who've replied so far. I simply enjoyed the weekend and did some bodywork. I'm not mad AT Shine, simply the tone of one post. Nothing personal. He made a point without firsthand knowledge which was the opposite of my question. Let's move on.

Again, to start with, this was going to be a simple spray-n-pray save-a-buck paint job. Plans changed a bit, so here we are. I've talked with 3 jobbers, and the paint on the ballot is Crossfire, Omni, and Nason (which the jobber for Nason doesn't seem concerned about returning a call). I've shot Nason with good results. What about Omni? For convenience (refills, supporting supplies and jobber support), Omni would get the nod. Is it worth a flip? When I asked, he stated it used no activator, but since, I've found both AE and AU don't require activator as such so I'm not sure which one we were discussing. I'll look more into that if it's worth the time.

Color is 2k (red). Price difference around here between the lower ends mentioned and the regular PPG and such is too much to consider. Anyone insisting, feel free to send cash! Otherwise, let's work within my budget.
 
Is this car a keeper?
Reds are the worse and my choice in this order is Nason, Omni, other I forgot so not listed>>>> LOL
Is this a factory code red? What kind of car is it?
 
Ya caught me on my way out the door (to work), so to be brief: It's an old Mustang I'm bringing back. Yep, it deserves more, but...

So, you put Nason in front of Omni? I suspected the opposite, but that's why I ask - I don't know about them. The color code is a factory code, but there is no matching involved as it's a complete inside/out redo. Focusing on Omni (for the moment/sake of conversation), he is selling the MBC AU I just found out for sure. I lean towards these guys as they've been in business the same time I've been in auto repair - 28 years. I "can" use the Nason, but support sucks and the paint comes from another county which makes refills, oops issues and such a problem. Locally, it's between Omni and Crossfire.
 
Well let me say up front I'm not a professional by any means, I've only painted about 3 cars in my life and I'm no spring chicken. I've always tried to use good paint, but like kmatch i don't have an unlimited budget. After spending a lot of time reading different forums about paint I was even more confused. So one day I was on the Chevelle forum and i was recommended to come here. After reading for months, I was convinced that there was a lot of professionals posting.

I was going to paint my Chevelle SS with Dupont until I found out how much that stuff costs. So I decided to ask on here and was delighted to find Pro-Spray from Chad s. His paint was half the price. I ordered a gallon of his paint and let me tell you it covers. I laid SPI white epoxy primer under it and it covered in two coats, but I added a third to make sure I didn't have any thin spots.. not a pro here, and used Universal Clear on top.

But the final results were far more than I ever expected it to be. My two brothers and my nephew wanted to know if I would paint their old hot rods for them and wondered if I would paint cars for a living.. I told them NO WAY.. They couldn't believe how my paint turned out. I want kmatch to know that there are cheaper alternatives out there and to follow the advice on this forum. I have been given free advice that works to a tee, for free.. what more can u ask for. Top notch advice and I appreciate all you guys have done for me.

BTW I have used different color basecoats from Chad and will never buy anywhere else.
 
if the Omni red covers as well as Omni black, then run like hell, its crap.
 
I also have to agree with barry on nason over omni! I have tried both and from what I remember I remember always getting better results from nason, whether it was base, clear, or single stage. It just seemed to be better all around, but it's been probably 7yrs since I have used either.

After having 2 omni jobs die back really bad I decided that using lower grade products wasn't worth it for me.
But I have to back up my work, you just have to please yourself.
 
I used omni twice. Both for my vehicles. Never again. The base took a ton of coats to cover and their ss was just a cheap enamel with a shot of "urethane additive" lmaoooo.. The base job died back and
 
the single stage job even though topcoated with universal, cracks underneath!!!!! Yes I said cracks.. It was fine on metal, but on my bumpers.. if u push on them it cracks under the clear like craZy!!
 
I understand painting inside a budget, however some corners need not be cut.. Just my opinion from a backyardagain hack :)
 
Interesting replies! I thought highly of Omni for some reason, then I did the research and came up with the same thing mentioned here over, and over, and over... it covers like water. While I can't hardly find bad reviews on a low end like Kirker, there's plenty of bad news about a supposed "upper" lower class like Omni. So a bit more searching on Nason gives it much higher grades than I expected. I've had personal good results with it the one time I used it from matching (not an issue here) to workability and others think it's a good bang for the buck. It may do for my needs. It's priced to match my abilities so it sounds like a plan. Let's remember one thing: A budget is one thing, but even $1000 paint won't make a hobo painter a pro. I've gotta paint within my abilities. On the other hand, better paints might hide some of my in-abilities. Hmmm... Thanks for ALL the help, guys. I'm still open to suggestions, though, so any other thoughts, by all means, post for there's room for lurkers to learn as well.
 
Curious as to whether you considered Pro-Spray, and why or why not.

I was seriously considering putting a Pro-Spray mixing bank in my shop, may still do it in the future when budget allows.
 
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