Where did I go wrong?

S

steve b

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Please see the attached pictures. Saturday night, I sprayed my trucks parts (bumpers, flares, etc...). I sprayed as follows:
- SPI epoxy as sealer, 1 med-wet coat, then wait 3 hours
- 1st base coat SPI Black base w/ slow reducer 1:1 and 1oz UV clear activator per quart, then wait 30 minutes
- 2nd base coat SPI Black base w/ slow reducer 1:1 and 1oz UV clear activator per quart, then wait 30 minutes
- 3rd base coat SPI Black base w/ slow reducer 1:1 and 1oz UV clear activator per quart, then wait 60 minutes
- 1st coat UV Clear w/ slow activator 1:1, then wait 30 minutes
- 2nd coat UV Clear w/ slow activator 1:1, then wait 30 minutes
- 3rd coat UV Clear w/ slow activator 1:1, then go home

Shop temps were 67 deg F

When I sprayed the final coat of clear, it was very slick and flat. I was very happy with it. Went to the shop the next morning and saw what appeared to be tiny fisheyes everywhere. Can anyone tell me what happened? I am pretty flustered by this, epsecially since it looked so good before I went home. Each coat of clear layed down nice and flat. What can or should I do to fix this?

The first pic is what it looked like after clear went on. THe second pic is the next day with the "fish-eyes"
 
Tough one but usually when happens next day it is coming from the base, not waiting long enough before clearing.
Could also be at 67 that it came from the epoxy as the base drew it into itself.
Hard to say as everything was done perfect and only thing I can see is metal temp and outside temp could have played a large role here.
 
So this is a solvent issue? It is pretty aggravating nonetheless. I figured the flash times I allowed for would be more than sufficent. I waited an hour to clear, what is reccommended? What can I do different here? I still have the cab and bed to do and do not want to deal with this again.

I am really debating whether to wetsand and flow coat, or wetsand and polish? I am planning on polishing regardless since I got a bit of dust to polish out.
 
After finding this site I started waiting overnight to spray my clear the difference it made Is unbelievable. I stopped having solvent pop problems, blushing, and even the problem you are having. Whether its driving a car or working on one the only thing speed does for me is cause problems. If it is going to be a restoration I wou'ld sand with 800 wet, set in the sun for a few days and reclear, if a collision job it might buff out, but my luck with a buffer aint too good.. Ain't nuthin like practice!
 
Steve, Yes it is a solvent issue and my best guess is you said it was 67, that means the metal temp is 58-62 if it was 67 all night long before you painted.
With the slow activators and reducer, I would say that at that temp, Shine is right, too many steps in one day for the temp.
 
I realize that this is a different system, and I thought I was doing fine per what the p-pages reccommend. So if I am not waiting long enough, or putting far too many coats..... what is the reccomended practice? Please feel free to copy my process above and redline as necessary.
 
too much too fast. first is slow should not be used in a cold shop. you put 7 coats on . the times you used are for a hot shop in summer at 80. i flash 30-45 min on clear in the summer . way too much solvent to get rid of at below 70. this is also what you will get with a cheap gun .
 
shine;34990 said:
too much too fast. first is slow should not be used in a cold shop. you put 7 coats on . the times you used are for a hot shop in summer at 80. i flash 30-45 min on clear in the summer . way too much solvent to get rid of at below 70. this is also what you will get with a cheap gun .
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Fair enough, so what are the reccomended flash times to use? I bought the slow activitors and reducers as was reccomended by SPI when I placed my order back in January. I do not mid waiting extra time, I just need to know what that time is?

As for the gun, I am using a conventional Iwata W400. Maybe its not the best on the market, but I do not believe it is a cheap gun?
 
Next time, spray sealer and base the first day and clear one day later. Also, get an infrared thermometer so you can keep an eye on your metal temperature. You can buy a cheap one for around $40. I always use mine if temperatures are anywhere close to the limits.
 
Guess I should have outlined my plan prior to spraying........lessons learned........ I was sitting in my car around 10:30 pm on saturday after my last coat of base went debating whether to go home or stay n spray clear. Guess I should have waited.

Does anyone actually know what the flash times should be for this setup or is the general consensus to wait till the next day to spray clear? What is the window of time limit between base and clear? If I end up sanding and just reclearing, what flash times should I use for the UV clear with slow hardener at 65-70 deg F?
 
For a restoration its better to wait overnight, For collision work most don't have time to wait that long I try to wait atleast a 1 hour. Color of base and how many coats is a big factor too. If doing collision work I try to keep it at 2 coats of clear and wait as long as I can before spraying the clear. If universal clear 30 minute flash times for the clear is normal. It gets easier just stick with it, keep it fun and don't let it frustrate you that's what you're wife's for!
 
curt b;34999 said:
For a restoration its better to wait overnight, For collision work most don't have time to wait that long I try to wait atleast a 1 hour. Color of base and how many coats is a big factor too. If doing collision work I try to keep it at 2 coats of clear and wait as long as I can before spraying the clear. If universal clear 30 minute flash times for the clear is normal. It gets easier just stick with it, keep it fun and don't let it frustrate you that's what you're wife's for!
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Amen, this is supposed to be fun. I need to remember that. I may try to polish some areas to see if the dimples go away. If not ill go for the flow coat
 
What gun are you using and set up? I tend to spray heavy and that can add to the dry times and help cause the paint to puddle and cause dimple like spots, at least with me it can, but I'm like david copperfield I can achieve the impossible when painting.
 
curt b;35003 said:
What gun are you using and set up? I tend to spray heavy and that can add to the dry times and help cause the paint to puddle and cause dimple like spots, at least with me it can, but I'm like david copperfield I can achieve the impossible when painting.
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Iwata W400 conventional with a 1.4 tip. Clear was sprayed @ 40 psi at the gun with the fluid needle about 2.5 turns out. I usually spray about 8" from the surface and move really quick. It laid really slick but changed overnight apparently
 
I recently started using a iwata lph 400 and had to learn to move slower and closer like 4 to 5 inches from the panel.When all the planets line up not matter what you do it won't work right.
 
I am still on the fence on whether to re-clear or polish. I plan to polish a small section and see how it comes out. If I reclear w/ 2 coats of UV, what is the coarsest grit I can get away with for blocking it out? Would it be a bad idea to flow coat with only one coat?
 
steve b, do you have a non-contact (infrared) thermometer? The surface temps are far more important than the air temp on a thermostat.

It seems like a lot of painters recommend slow activators and reducers in all conditions, but I find that in my mostly cool environment, it pays to carefully select products to get the best balance of properties. Slower products to tend to produce a better looking finish, but not if the solvents just sit there in the film.

I think that the slow clear activator might have been fine, but the slow reducer in the base might have become trapped in the basecoat layer. Sometimes I will use a blend of reducers for basecoat based of the surface temperature of the part, and the size of the job.
 
steve b;35016 said:
I am still on the fence on whether to re-clear or polish. I plan to polish a small section and see how it comes out. If I reclear w/ 2 coats of UV, what is the coarsest grit I can get away with for blocking it out? Would it be a bad idea to flow coat with only one coat?
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You should flow coat with a minimum of 2 coats, after the parts have had a good while to cure in the sun and/or with warm surface temps. You don't want to bury a solvent trapping problem with more material.
 
If I were going to reclear it I would wet sand with 800 and 2 to 3 coats of clear. It will surprise you how much 2 coats of uv clear really is.
 
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