P
PatG
Shine, I know you have a lot more painting experience than I do, but I definitely didn't slam on a heavy coat, and these don't look like trapped solvents. If they were, then it wouldn't be patchy and the surface problems wouldn't be so localized. I painted a this very small part and was very consistent in my application thickness (well, as consistent as I could be, given my skill level). I really don't think I could have put on a much thinner coat, without just dusting the paint on, which is inconsistent with instructions I've received previously. I do think it could be related to prep/cleaning - I sandblasted this part and wiped with solvent W&G remover. So, I tried. This is not a visible panel (tucked inside wheel well - so metal surface was bare, and pockmarked from previous rust.
Please don't shoot the messenger on this post. I'm sharing my experiences and looking for solutions. And yes, I'm a bit frustrated, of course. SPI is for home users too - not just for experienced painters and shops. Note I've posted my successes using UV Clear and 2K primer and am an advocate for both products. Just can't seem to get the primer to work for me (yet...).
Please don't shoot the messenger on this post. I'm sharing my experiences and looking for solutions. And yes, I'm a bit frustrated, of course. SPI is for home users too - not just for experienced painters and shops. Note I've posted my successes using UV Clear and 2K primer and am an advocate for both products. Just can't seem to get the primer to work for me (yet...).
crashtech
Combo Man & Mod
Sometimes problems can be a combination of different things. One possible combination: Remnants of W&G remover stuck in metal pores, plus slightly low gun pressure and/or too much material flow, plus slight over-application, and boom, there is your horrible looking problem.
Try a slight tweak on all of the above and see what happens, wait longer after cleaning, bump your air up a touch, turn your material in a half turn, and try to find that point where you get a thin as possible but glossy first coat. The epoxy, like many other materials, levels out slightly several seconds after spraying, so care is needed not to overapply. Is that the white? If so, it will be somewhat translucent after the first coat, which is OK and expected.
Try a slight tweak on all of the above and see what happens, wait longer after cleaning, bump your air up a touch, turn your material in a half turn, and try to find that point where you get a thin as possible but glossy first coat. The epoxy, like many other materials, levels out slightly several seconds after spraying, so care is needed not to overapply. Is that the white? If so, it will be somewhat translucent after the first coat, which is OK and expected.
shine
Member
it looks like you shot it with the pattern running length wise. small piece big gun . clear will do this also if you get carried away. especially on small pieces. turn your fluid down 1/2 turn and pressure up just a little. solvents are not your friend. there were many clears in the late 80's and 90's that would do this on first coat. even though we knew it was clean. it is either cleaning failure or application. i know it's frustrating but it is the nature of the beast. this is why many of the old clears would say to put on a light first coat then a med coat. it's just easy to get small pieces way to wet even though you dont think so. try backing off some.
crash was typing faster than me.........
crash was typing faster than me.........
P
PatG
Thanks Crash
Advice much appreciated. I've got a lot to learn and am working under less than ideal conditions (home restoration). I'll take your recommendations and see how things go. Will circle back in about a week, with an update.
pat
Advice much appreciated. I've got a lot to learn and am working under less than ideal conditions (home restoration). I'll take your recommendations and see how things go. Will circle back in about a week, with an update.
pat
crashtech;22759 said:
P
PatG
And Shine - thanks as well. I'll take all advice and circle back with some results in about a week. Much appreciated.
Pat
Pat
shine;22761 said:
P
PatG
One thing I will say is that this very first coat was unreduced primer but it had induced for about two days. It was pretty thick when I shot it. I then tried to reduce it and found out that you should add your reducer to the primer at the time of mixing and not two days later. It made a sort of "cream of wheat" consistency and would not mix. So, I dumped it, mixed up another 10 ounces and added two ounces of slow reducer. That is what I shot for second coat and for the back half of this panel. The second reduced batch worked much better, went on thinner, and did not create the moonscape problem that I had on first batch.
What did I learn? 1) Don't shoot primer after two hot days in the garage - it will probably already be thickening (cross linking or whatever you call it). 2) If you want to reduce your primer, reduce it at the time of mixing and not two days later. 3) And when you think your part is clean, clean it again and allow W&G remover lots of time to dry before shooting.
And, of course I'll try to shoot less material at higher gun pressure, as per advice above.
Pat
What did I learn? 1) Don't shoot primer after two hot days in the garage - it will probably already be thickening (cross linking or whatever you call it). 2) If you want to reduce your primer, reduce it at the time of mixing and not two days later. 3) And when you think your part is clean, clean it again and allow W&G remover lots of time to dry before shooting.
And, of course I'll try to shoot less material at higher gun pressure, as per advice above.
Pat
F
form406
i sprayed again this weekend in my filthy garage with no problems. that looks seriously heavy coat! and the fisheyes are way abby normal. if you folks saw where i spray youd be aghast, LOL, and i dont have any problems. i dont use solvent w&g remover anymore because of the possibility of fisheyes. if youre sandblasting and not smoothing it out with 80 you cant clean the surface properly and you will have trapped contaminants and left over cleaner.. we will figure it out.
S
Steves69LS3
i have a SATA 4000RP i set my fan at 60% pressure with trigger fully pulled at 30 psi and fluid out only 1-1/2 turns and i had alot of fisheye problems before setting my gun to this setting. the setting above has let me lay the epoxy as flat as glass with absolutely no blemishes
[/URL][/IMG]
[/URL][/IMG]
B
Bob Hollinshead
The problem with blasting parts is the contaminants can get pounded into the surface of the steel and it'll take more effort to clean it properly. Soak the area down good with solvent based wax and grease remover and towel it off, follow it up with waterborne and towel it off, then if you have any lint that's snagged on that rough texture you can dislodge it with some compressed air and a swipe with a new maroon/red scotchbrite. The ideal thing to do is to degrease before any blasting gets done and don't recycle your abrasive if there's areas being shot that have grease, road tar, motor oil, wax, armor all, etc... When the part is clean, your air supply is clean, there will be no more fisheyes.
I know of one painter that shares space in a diesel truck shop, he was happy to say when he switched from paint brand D to paint brand S that his fisheye problems disappeared. His fisheyes were gone but it didn't change the fact there was some major contamination problems in the environment there!
I know of one painter that shares space in a diesel truck shop, he was happy to say when he switched from paint brand D to paint brand S that his fisheye problems disappeared. His fisheyes were gone but it didn't change the fact there was some major contamination problems in the environment there!
J
jwd
I've shot the epoxy primer on 2 cars in the last month and there wasn't a single fisheye. It certainly isn't the product at fault. It's either equipment or application error.
S
Steves69LS3
Also note that if you use air powered sanders and put a drop of oil in them after s day of use. The next time you use them that oil comes out the exhaust in a vapor and will get all over and contaminate the area your working on
P
PatG
Hello everyone:
By way of update, I mixed up 16 ounces of white epoxy primer yesterday, 30 minute induction, no reducer, and it layed down perfectly, except for one place where I sprayed it too thick and it cratered a bit. I had cleaned the areas very well with waterborne cleaner and wiped with half a roll of paper towels. Product flashed in 45 minutes and I covered it with three coats of 2 K primer. So, I am pretty sure that my previous problems are primarily related to spray technique (and perhaps, cleaning). I used my SRI Pro detail gun for this spraying and it performed very well. Thanks for all the earlier comments.
Pat
By way of update, I mixed up 16 ounces of white epoxy primer yesterday, 30 minute induction, no reducer, and it layed down perfectly, except for one place where I sprayed it too thick and it cratered a bit. I had cleaned the areas very well with waterborne cleaner and wiped with half a roll of paper towels. Product flashed in 45 minutes and I covered it with three coats of 2 K primer. So, I am pretty sure that my previous problems are primarily related to spray technique (and perhaps, cleaning). I used my SRI Pro detail gun for this spraying and it performed very well. Thanks for all the earlier comments.
Pat