Shop AC

dhutton01

dhutton01

Backyard Hack
After trying to find someone to install AC in my shop I installed one of these all in one units today. 3.5 ton, purchased from Alpine Air who Barry recommended. Easy to install, two ducts through the shop wall for cooled air and return air. I dump the cooled air over where I spend most of my time and draw the return at the opposite end of the shop. 14 SEER. Nice that the unit comes precharged with Freon so no AC guys needed. Today it rained and it was 90 and muggy. Closed the shop doors and it pulled it down to 74 in a couple of hours. Humidity was gone. Happy so far. Next week it will be sunny and 103, hoping for good results.

I’m guessing it cost me less than half what an AC contractor would have charged me.

Don
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dhutton01 said:
After trying to find someone to install AC in my shop I installed one of these all in one units today. 3.5 ton, purchased from Alpine Air who Barry recommended. Easy to install, two ducts through the shop wall for cooled air and return air. I dump the cooled air over where I spend most of my time and draw the return at the opposite end of the shop. 14 SEER. Nice that the unit comes precharged with Freon so no AC guys needed. Today it rained and it was 90 and muggy. Closed the shop doors and it pulled it down to 74 in a couple of hours. Humidity was gone. Happy so far. Next week it will be sunny and 103, hoping for good results.

I’m guessing it cost me less than half what an AC contractor would have charged me.

Don
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have been lookin what model is this unit?
 
Here is something I have proven with my 5-ton units.
They cost nothing to run; all you pay for is the electric motor running, heat, or air.
Cheaper to leave at the temp you want 24 hours a day, so it hardly runs at night, and in our case, the totes, 55-gallon drums, stay cool or warm in winter and help maintain the temp with less time the units run during the heat of the day.
Also, Alpine has an excellent tech line, and they dont read answers from a Q-Card.
 
Barry said:
Here is something I have proven with my 5-ton units.
They cost nothing to run; all you pay for is the electric motor running, heat, or air.
Cheaper to leave at the temp you want 24 hours a day, so it hardly runs at night, and in our case, the totes, 55-gallon drums, stay cool or warm in winter and help maintain the temp with less time the units run during the heat of the day.
Also, Alpine has an excellent tech line, and they dont read answers from a Q-Card.
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This, I do not know why people do anything different.
 
@dhutton01 , if you would care to add more detail on what you had to do to duct the air etc. I'd be very interested, it's something I'm thinking about doing in the next few years.
 
crashtech said:
@dhutton01 , if you would care to add more detail on what you had to do to duct the air etc. I'd be very interested, it's something I'm thinking about doing in the next few years.
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Sure I will post some pics. Nothing fancy at all. Still trying to figure out best way to filter the return air.

Don
 
Most people don't understand that EVERYTHING in the structure has to be cooled down not just YOU.
When you maintain a consistent temp,everything stays consistent and different objects require different amounts of time to adjust.
Like pulling your vehicle into the garage after work when it's 98* and shutting the garage door.....Genius....
Or in Barry's case,A pallet load of product thats been in an enclosed trailer for all day or more arriving that late afternoon. Which would be the ideal time considering everything will be closed and shut down for the Evening and easier recovery time for the A/C.
Whatever type unit you use,packaged or split, furnace or air handler indoors a/c outside MUST have 'something' to restrict the outlet air flow enough to add static pressure to the air flow. Just letting it blow out the unit opening will KILL your blower motor shortly.
I'm not sure what kind of Warranty these Internet sellers offer but something to investigate because the parts for these units are not cheap.
And Manufactures will often negate ANY Warranty on Internet sold equipment.
Besides the 14 SEER equipment will be cheaper now since the DOE is implementing the New 15 SEER for the 14 SEER minimum Zones Jan. 1 2023 which should to prove a real shit storm because most distributors only HAVE 14 SEER warehoused currently IF they even have that.
COVID Wrecked the Manufacturing and is still screwed just trying to get hvac equipment period.
Plus whatever the "new" Rating system is going to be come 2023.
Then,
R410-A is phased out as of Jan 2023 and ,supposedly,not available after that.Remember now,IT was proclaimed,
"The Enviromentally Friendly Refrigerant" Totally developed because the Government mandated it.But now it's the Devil Brew.
Not really sure what 'alternative' snake oil replacements are available exactly for 410-A.
Like R-22 but instead of a 10 year phase out,got thrown off the cliff head first.
AND,
The Industry as a WHOLE Doesn't even KNOW which New Refrigerant They will be USING IN NEW EQUIPMENT.
I retired almost 3 years ago and This Industry has completely changed practically overnight from everything I knew as the Future when I quit.
FUBAR.......
Yup, JOE took care of that for US.
The Government wants U.S. to be E.U. because that's what They are doing We are supposed too.
 
Still trying to figure out best way to filter the return air.

Nothing else,build a plywood box with a 25x25 filter grill or 2-20x20 filter grills because a single 20x25 won't be big enough really.Or a Framed opening to hold the filter and hell,chicken wire grill to keep the junk out. Or if you want, use a 2" thick instead of a 1". More sturdier and more media per sq.inch.
Would it work? Yes but remember the Return is Where ALL the Air your trying to cool with Comes From.
Can't Blow out more than you can Suck in.
HVAC Law #14. ;)
 
MikeK said:
Still trying to figure out best way to filter the return air.

Nothing else,build a plywood box with a 25x25 filter grill or 2-20x20 filter grills because a single 20x25 won't be big enough really.Or a Framed opening to hold the filter and hell,chicken wire grill to keep the junk out. Or if you want, use a 2" thick instead of a 1". More sturdier and more media per sq.inch.
Would it work? Yes but remember the Return is Where ALL the Air your trying to cool with Comes From.
Can't Blow out more than you can Suck in.
HVAC Law #14. ;)
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I will send some pictures of homemade ducting and air return when I get it.

We are not professional, but for all the return boxes we order from alpine, our setup has worked perfectly for 15 years
And this will give you a general idea on the cheap.
 

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In a clean room 25x25 would work but in a dusty shop I'd go with the 2x20x20 and even then run the blue rolled filter media over them. Keep as much dust out as possible and filter media saves your filters.
I was looking at Goodmans 8 years ago when I built my shop but it would be heat/propane and ac. Was looking at mounting it on a platform because of floor space. They look like pretty good units.
 
You still have the same equipment when you built your warehouse Barry ?
I don't remember the Brand but was thinking Goodman or maybe Heil,Tempstar. That was awhile back.
Yeah,every week is little overkill but with the return grills down at floor level are going to pick up more anyway.
I purposely left my return up high where the A/H is hanging. Less filth and actually better Heat performance from the heat pump.
I was even going to do a dual return with high and low intakes and switch between Seasons but that just took up too much floor space and really was a little OCD anyway. You actually DON'T have to Insulate your Duct Inside an Open,Conditioned structure. Conditioned areas are well below Dew Point ambient and won't sweat. You don't keep a fairly consistent Temp and just run It when your in there,might need too for the A/C aspect.
Goodman started Life as one of the Economy lines aka cheap POS but became a Top end Line and really put the Hurt on the Majors actually getting them more competitive price wise but Todays market is like everything now and becoming bought up by Corporations with no real Interest in anything but $$$. Google United Technologies.
Equipment is becoming Excessively overcomplicated with Electronics like Everything else now. DC inverter technology has taken over compressors and any 'motor' which is great efficiency wise except It's extreme displeasure of 'dirty power' and Lightning surges becomes very expensive at some point. With basically a Laptop on your wall controlling the Comfort in your structure which WILL eventually be controlled by the Utility suppliers when Demand for Electricity will fall short due to inadequate Supply due to Fossil Fuel plants closing with no viable replacement outside of Nuke's because Wind and Solar right now won't,if Ever.
BTW, How much will it cost to re roof your house with all those Solar Panels on top ?
 
Yes, all the same units except one I had to replace.
All are Goodmans.

The local heat guy had to come every 30 days to fix a leak in one unit, and the same day he had to do the same thing for the office down the street, but such a good guy did not charge us labor, just the cost of freon.
After a year of this, I called Apine and came unglued, and the guy said unless you are driving this thing on the street, you are not getting a leak
Every month. It is a scam by your service guy.
I had a new guy I had met come in, and he showed me how the guy had one fitting just slightly loose for a prolonged leak.
The guy said the tubes were so butchered with fake welds with replace all or buy a new one, called alpine and asked them, and they cut me a deal.
Oh, of course, I told the other guy he was doing this too, and he lost two suckers and 600 dollars a month of free income.

I love the Alpine company!!!
 
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