runs

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Panelwagon62

The head painter at the shop I work at has been getting a lot of runs latley. Its cheap acme clear and he hammers 2 coats wet on wet. He says it because the temp in the booth is 80 and his clear is only 55 degrees. Does this sound like a reasonable explanation?
 
Tell him to adjust the fluid to about 2.5 turns out and fan 90% wide open and add 5lbs of air to the gun with trigger pulled.

If he won't listen to you tell him to learn how to tape a run out.
 
Runs on the first coat or second? I bet he really struggles on completes.
 
of all the painters he should be the one that doesnt get runs... good painters dont make the same mistakes over and over...
 
Usually he doesn't get runs, just lots of dirt haha. Worst part is he doesn't have to buff the detailer does. The runs are usually the second coat but he blames it on the fact that inside the booth is 80 degrees and the temp of his mixed clear is cooler and that's why it happens. Is this a legit excuse?
 
guess if that is his excuse, store his paint in an 80 degree container, refrigerator with a light bulb on should be adequate. no more excuses then.
 
Could you please explain as to why that theory is incorrect?
 
U can also warm the clear up by putting the clear in a can or pps cup whatever you use. Get a small bucket and fill up with some hot water and place the can in the water. let clear set in the water for a few minutes and will be nice and warm
 
Could it be that his clear is a lot thicker because it's cold so he has to hammer it to get it slick meaning it will need longer flash time before the second coat?
 
Panelwagon62;13566 said:
Could you please explain as to why that theory is incorrect?
Click to expand...

His "excuse" is based upon the clear coat being too cold to properly flow until it is applied to the warmer metal surface. However if he knows what the problem is then it is no longer a valid excuse is it? The solution to the problem is a no brainer and he needs to correct it and stop being lazy rather than continuing to cause more work for those who follow him.
 
I painted a bumper today with a panel and clear temp of around 45deg.(and in 15mph winds). No runs and thanks to polar, I was able to run my finger across it in less than 30 minutes.
 
Panelwagon62;13566 said:
Could you please explain as to why that theory is incorrect?
Click to expand...

Because if this is a constant condition, it should only happen once or twice. A decent painter will compensate for the paint's tendency to run by adjusting technique. I'd bet in less than 30 seconds the clear and the vehicle panel reach the same temp anyway. I'd be really happy to spray in 80° temps, you can bet there would be no whining from me about that!

It could be that the clear being used is just crap, in that case there is still no reason to get runs, but the appearance might not be as wet as one would like. Apparently all the jobs get buffed anyway. so a bit of texture should be less of a concern than runs.
 
There are a lot of things that could be causing runs Is the pattern on the gun even not allowing engouh flash time between coats just to name a few.
 
Don't blame the clear. It isn't spraying itself, and I'd bet that there are a lot of people that get it to lay down just fine. It is quite simple. It is the painter, his technique and gun set-up. Adjustments in the way he sprays it will take care of it. Maybe some of his hot air should be used to heat the clear, if he thinks the temp is the problem, which it isn't.

Painters in production shops are often quite lazy. If they don't have to do the buffing, they will not worry about the finished product. If he had to do the buffing, I can guarantee you that he would figure out his problem.

Aaron
 
Yeah it is a cheap crap clear I agree but your right its not the clears fault. I have sprayed a few jobs with that clear and haven't had issues. Another problem he has sometimes is dieback......really bad. I can't believe the customer accepts it!! And one thing I can't stand about our shop is the painter doesn't fix his own work, complete B.S. there was a medium sized job in the shop, 2010 chevy 1500. Hood, both fenders, both passenger side doors and driverside front door got blended, the detailer spent a day and a half buffing. All time that just went out the door.
 
It's hard to make money buffing. I think he should fix the problem, change his technique, gun, warm the product, change the product-whatever it takes. Dieback is another result of to much material to fast.
 
Bob.... You're exactly right. No one really makes money buffing that stuff out. If the painters are held responsible for it, they will find the solution to prevent the problems. Take the gun out of his hand and give him a buffer and he will do it differently.

In this area, it is becomming more comon in the busier shops, for the painter to just push off the buffing to someone else, so it doesn't slow them down. The shop management seems to think that painters are magicians, so they treat them with kid gloves. If a bodyman's work came out like that they would can them.

In the last shop I worked in the painter was so full of crap, and the boss thought he walked on water. The guy even told us, when the discussion turned to the painter's helpers screwing up bodywork, that a DA with 320 and an interface pad, will not even leave sanding marks. The boss believed him, completely, even though bodywork was coming back from the paint shop with metal showing where there had been bondo.

I remember shooting lacquer jobs and clearing them. The clear was just like spraying water, but you could do it without runs. If someone is a real "painter" and not just a "trigger man", then they can learn to spray the stuff. A run here and there is one thing, but it is the painter's error that caused them, not the product.

Aaron
 
A shop in town, at one time started docking pay off the painters' checks for the amount of trash or runs they had in their finishes. It pissed a lot of them off, but when you have a problem like that...it needs to be solved on the paint end. Insurance doesn't pay for any buffing...atleast here they dont. Their jobs started coming out a lot cleaner!!!!

One head painter they had, would use a new tack rag for every car. The boss didn't like it but every job he put out was squeeky clean.

Moral of the story...we are all human. When given the chance to pass the buck, we all aren't perfect!! Eliminate that chance and problem solved!
 
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