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GM 405Y

#1
I use Standox solvent. Anyone have experience and tips on spraying this color? It's the tinted clear mid-coat type. Anyway to get around it? This is for used car stuff but I still want it to look really good.
 

Chris_Hamilton

Trying to be the best me, I can be
#2
I've shot that color several times, mainly on Silverados. It's not the easiest 3 stage to spray. I've had to redo 2 jobs for the other painter at the last shop I was at because he couldn't blend it. And there is no alternative 2 stage formula like there was for the old Ford Laser Red. So it is what it is. What are you spraying? Why do you not want to spray the 3 stage? I will add that sealer color is critical on it. Too dark and it throws everything off. Neutral gray sealer or primer (if you are not sealing) is what's needed. And especially if you want it to look good the only way I would know how to do it is to spray the color as intended.
 
#5
One of the variants, Standox mix # 863875, is a two-stage, but it doesn't seem to match the late models.

I would assume the reason that AAE wants to avoid the 3-stage is because in Standox, the midcoat is a tinted urethane clear, specifically PFC 20. This makes it more difficult to use in an air dry environment, since the flash time is very slow, and the TDS calls for a short bake of the tinted midcoat followed by a 1.5 coat clear process. Blending has to be done with a double-gun procedure like we used to do with single-stage blends, the second gun filled with straight untinted PFC 20.
 

Chris_Hamilton

Trying to be the best me, I can be
#6
My experience with it has been with Cromax Mosaic and when using the VIN it never provided any 2 stage formulas. AAE you may want to try Mosaic as it uses the more conventional (basemaker) midcoat. Possibly the 2 stage DBC would work but I doubt it as the Silverados and Tahoes that I've shot all had that 3 stage look about them, that I don't think you could blend with a 2 stage. It is a deceptively difficult color to blend. Very candyesque. If you aren't careful the blend transition area will show darker like it does when you spray a candy unevenly. Last one I did I had to reduce the midcoat with blender alot and spray more coats to creep up on it. Also extended into the next adjacent panel to allow for extra blend area.
 
#7
I've done a couple of GM red tri-coats recently in their waterborne Cromax EZ line, WA434B and other Cadillac I can't recall the code right now and they were pretty effortless as long as you have a good formula to start with. Their red tinted clear-coat implementation is way easier than most waterline applications I have done. A bit pricey but worth the time savings and less hassle.
 
#8
One of the variants, Standox mix # 863875, is a two-stage, but it doesn't seem to match the late models.

I would assume the reason that AAE wants to avoid the 3-stage is because in Standox, the midcoat is a tinted urethane clear, specifically PFC 20. This makes it more difficult to use in an air dry environment, since the flash time is very slow, and the TDS calls for a short bake of the tinted midcoat followed by a 1.5 coat clear process. Blending has to be done with a double-gun procedure like we used to do with single-stage blends, the second gun filled with straight untinted PFC 20.
BINGO! That's why I don't wanna do it!
 

MPH

New Member
#9
I'll know how well the dbc 2 stage works in a week or so. According to my local ppg jobber there is 19 variants of this color all 2 stage. The one I got happens to be for my own 2017 Silverado so I guess I get to learn on my own dime. Will definitely be the hardest color I've ever blended, or at least looks like it will be.
 

Chris_Hamilton

Trying to be the best me, I can be
#10
I'll know how well the dbc 2 stage works in a week or so. According to my local ppg jobber there is 19 variants of this color all 2 stage. The one I got happens to be for my own 2017 Silverado so I guess I get to learn on my own dime. Will definitely be the hardest color I've ever blended, or at least looks like it will be.
My experience with most 3 stage reds has been similar to what Jorge said. Usually very easy to blend. That's why it was surprising how difficult that 405 was on multiple different vehicles. Use a neutral gray sealer or primer on the repair area(if you don't seal). That is important. Too dark and it will throw off the blend. Get some blender (PPG DBC500 or SPI intercoat). Reduce your last 2 coats of RTS base at least 1:1 with the blender if you are having trouble. Hope it works out for you.
 
#11
I'll know how well the dbc 2 stage works in a week or so. According to my local ppg jobber there is 19 variants of this color all 2 stage. The one I got happens to be for my own 2017 Silverado so I guess I get to learn on my own dime. Will definitely be the hardest color I've ever blended, or at least looks like it will be.
Just did a bedside, cab corner and 2 doors on a '17 silverado with DBC. Was surprised it was not a 3 stage formula. Prime formula matched really well and blended as easy as any similar color. I used DBC 500 as a wet bed on the front door, then diluted the color after coverage 1:1 with the 500 to make the blend and that was it. New bedside, and I didn't have to blend the tailgate. Price was ridiculous, but it worked.
 
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#12
Anyone know why the clear coat is used as the carrier? I wonder how an intercoat would work. One of you try it and let us know.
 
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