Final sanding, buffer selection, pads, compounds, and Information Overload….

M

MAKZ06

Newbie
I haven’t had a chance to get started on the cut and buff after completing the spray of the single-stage on my F100 a few months ago. Looks like I’ll hit it in the spring when I get back to our place in N GA. In the mean time I have been reading and studying the old cut and buff threads on the forum and trying to get my ducks in a row. So far I have acquired the following which I plan to use unless someone points me in another direction.

Sunmight 1000 green film 6” discs
Sunmight 1200 green film 6” discs (most of my reading seems to indicate I can skip the 1200)
Sunmight 1500 green film 6” discs
Sunmight 3000 red SunFoam 6” discs (I’m wondering if I should instead use the Eagle Buflex 2500 blue, or the Trizact 3000)
Trizact 8000 6” discs
I also have a half dozen soft interface pads, as well as some hand sanding pads so I can hand sand with the 6” discs where I can’t or don’t want to use the DA. Also have the Tolecut kit for smaller areas.

Does the above list of products and progression sound correct? I’m a little unsure about going from the SunFoam 3000 to the Trizact 8000, since most seemed to use the Eagle Buflex 2500 blue. Then I saw that Jim C has I think switched back to Trizact 3000 followed by 8000. If I remember correctly I had ordered the SunFoam after a positive post from Shine. Yeah, I think I am overthinking all this and going in circles…

I need to buy a buffer. Most here seem to be proponents of the old style rotary (ex Flex 3403). However, I’ve seen a lot of recommendations elsewhere for a gear-driven DA (ie Flex 3401 or Rupes Bigfoot Mille). I won’t go into the arguments I’ve seen for and against elsewhere, but would love to hear your firsthand experiences and comparisons. Does anyone here think the gear-driven DA option is one I should consider?

Lastly, I need recommendations on the specific buffer polisher, foam pads, wool pad?, compound, polish, mfr and #s. I’ve read so many threads and different recommendations on the pads and compounds that I’m overwhelmed…. o_O Hell, you can see I’m even vacillating on the abrasive papers. I just need to know what steps and products to use after the final pass with the Trizact 8000.
 
your list looks ok sort of. just ditch the 1200. its not needed. i didnt have good luck with the sunfoam 3000. i was however using the green ones which are silicon carbide grit, not the red. i dont use the 3000 trizact at all. some years back i did. in any case i went back to blue bufflex. you really cant beat blue bufflex. its the cheapest thing going and it last as long as trizact. even though it says dry, be sure you use the bufflex wet. go from 1500 green film to the blue. do the the blue once really good, clean the panel off and do it one more time. from that point you can buff or go to 8000. your choice.

i just bought my second flex buffer. i liked the first one so much i needed another. i got a pe14-3-125. this is the updated version of the vrg3401 that i have had for years. these are not full size buffers. they swing a 6-7" pad instead of the full size 8-9". they are so light. the body is the size of an electric grinder so you can use it one handed. i run these almost all day at least 4 days a week.

compound with wool and 3d aca510. polish with black foam and 3d aca520

overall its a pretty simple process. its the fastest way to go that i have found to date. as with anything though it takes some time to figure out materials. how long to go with each grit and all the little tricks. i have it down to such a science that i can do it almost blindfolded. i dont even have to think about it really. just dont expect that right out of the gate. some guys here can attest to that.
 
Jim C said:
your list looks ok sort of. just ditch the 1200. its not needed. i didnt have good luck with the sunfoam 3000. i was however using the green ones which are silicon carbide grit, not the red. i dont use the 3000 trizact at all. some years back i did. in any case i went back to blue bufflex. you really cant beat blue bufflex. its the cheapest thing going and it last as long as trizact. even though it says dry, be sure you use the bufflex wet. go from 1500 green film to the blue. do the the blue once really good, clean the panel off and do it one more time. from that point you can buff or go to 8000. your choice.

i just bought my second flex buffer. i liked the first one so much i needed another. i got a pe14-3-125. this is the updated version of the vrg3401 that i have had for years. these are not full size buffers. they swing a 6-7" pad instead of the full size 8-9". they are so light. the body is the size of an electric grinder so you can use it one handed. i run these almost all day at least 4 days a week.

compound with wool and 3d aca510. polish with black foam and 3d aca520

overall its a pretty simple process. its the fastest way to go that i have found to date. as with anything though it takes some time to figure out materials. how long to go with each grit and all the little tricks. i have it down to such a science that i can do it almost blindfolded. i dont even have to think about it really. just dont expect that right out of the gate. some guys here can attest to that.
Click to expand...
Thank you so much. That‘s exactly the kind of response and information that I needed and was hoping for.
I got so frustrated a couple months ago while reading/researching and trying to come up with a plan that I just threw my hands up and put it out of my mind for a while...
I can go ahead and work on my final order list today and start checking online sources/dealers.
thanks again
 
Jim C said:
your list looks ok sort of. just ditch the 1200. its not needed. i didnt have good luck with the sunfoam 3000. i was however using the green ones which are silicon carbide grit, not the red. i dont use the 3000 trizact at all. some years back i did. in any case i went back to blue bufflex. you really cant beat blue bufflex. its the cheapest thing going and it last as long as trizact. even though it says dry, be sure you use the bufflex wet. go from 1500 green film to the blue. do the the blue once really good, clean the panel off and do it one more time. from that point you can buff or go to 8000. your choice.

i just bought my second flex buffer. i liked the first one so much i needed another. i got a pe14-3-125. this is the updated version of the vrg3401 that i have had for years. these are not full size buffers. they swing a 6-7" pad instead of the full size 8-9". they are so light. the body is the size of an electric grinder so you can use it one handed. i run these almost all day at least 4 days a week.

compound with wool and 3d aca510. polish with black foam and 3d aca520

overall its a pretty simple process. its the fastest way to go that i have found to date. as with anything though it takes some time to figure out materials. how long to go with each grit and all the little tricks. i have it down to such a science that i can do it almost blindfolded. i dont even have to think about it really. just dont expect that right out of the gate. some guys here can attest to that.
Click to expand...
What compounds are you using?
 
Never tried the ACA yet but did act on the numerous recommendations to try Megs M100 (can actually get it at Harbor Freight) and it cuts very well with wool.

I’ve had an extremely frustrating learning curve with the dry films.
 
Lizer said:
Never tried the ACA yet but did act on the numerous recommendations to try Megs M100 (can actually get it at Harbor Freight) and it cuts very well with wool.

I’ve had an extremely frustrating learning curve with the dry films.
Click to expand...
I remember reading your thread about that. I did a couple small parts by hand using the Sunmight 1000, 1200, 1500, and 3000 foam. I’m optimistic for the sanding phase since it went so well. Very quick and easy, giving a nice uniform cutting/dulling between each grit. I didn’t really see anything happening with the 1200 though so may skip it since everyone else seems to. Although since I have it I guess it won’t add that much time in the whole scheme of things.
The buffing part is what has me worried. I’ve never done it and it seems like that is much more difficult to see or know when you have done enough and when to move to the next pad and compound, etc. I’m going to order the Flex rotary, but I’m still not clear why one of the “forced rotation“ DAs wouldn’t do the job albeit slightly slower. Most of the finishing and detailing forums seem to all push the DAs as beinb the way to go even for major corrections and after color sanding. I wish I had access to both just so I could try it to see the differences.
I saw one of those Lake Country 5 in 1 machines on the local classifieds the other day. That looks interesting but also looks heavy.
 
MAKZ06 said:
I remember reading your thread about that. I did a couple small parts by hand using the Sunmight 1000, 1200, 1500, and 3000 foam. I’m optimistic for the sanding phase since it went so well. Very quick and easy, giving a nice uniform cutting/dulling between each grit. I didn’t really see anything happening with the 1200 though so may skip it since everyone else seems to. Although since I have it I guess it won’t add that much time in the whole scheme of things.
The buffing part is what has me worried. I’ve never done it and it seems like that is much more difficult to see or know when you have done enough and when to move to the next pad and compound, etc. I’m going to order the Flex rotary, but I’m still not clear why one of the “forced rotation“ DAs wouldn’t do the job albeit slightly slower. Most of the finishing and detailing forums seem to all push the DAs as beinb the way to go even for major corrections and after color sanding. I wish I had access to both just so I could try it to see the differences.
I saw one of those Lake Country 5 in 1 machines on the local classifieds the other day. That looks interesting but also looks heavy.
Click to expand...
The downside of using 1200 is that you are most likely needlessly removing material which could be an issue for a novice imo…
 
MAKZ06 said:
I remember reading your thread about that. I did a couple small parts by hand using the Sunmight 1000, 1200, 1500, and 3000 foam. I’m optimistic for the sanding phase since it went so well. Very quick and easy, giving a nice uniform cutting/dulling between each grit. I didn’t really see anything happening with the 1200 though so may skip it since everyone else seems to. Although since I have it I guess it won’t add that much time in the whole scheme of things.
The buffing part is what has me worried. I’ve never done it and it seems like that is much more difficult to see or know when you have done enough and when to move to the next pad and compound, etc. I’m going to order the Flex rotary, but I’m still not clear why one of the “forced rotation“ DAs wouldn’t do the job albeit slightly slower. Most of the finishing and detailing forums seem to all push the DAs as beinb the way to go even for major corrections and after color sanding. I wish I had access to both just so I could try it to see the differences.
I saw one of those Lake Country 5 in 1 machines on the local classifieds the other day. That looks interesting but also looks heavy.
Click to expand...
You can certainly cut and finish with a forced rotation machine such as flex. Just not quite as fast as a rotary as you said. But honestly if you’re sanding up to 8000 grit you can polish that out pretty easily…even with a long throw free spinning machine if you wanted. It’s all about pad and compound choice. I use 3D as well, I find it pretty much the best out there.
 
Jim C said:
your list looks ok sort of. just ditch the 1200. its not needed. i didnt have good luck with the sunfoam 3000. i was however using the green ones which are silicon carbide grit, not the red. i dont use the 3000 trizact at all. some years back i did. in any case i went back to blue bufflex. you really cant beat blue bufflex. its the cheapest thing going and it last as long as trizact. even though it says dry, be sure you use the bufflex wet. go from 1500 green film to the blue. do the the blue once really good, clean the panel off and do it one more time. from that point you can buff or go to 8000. your choice.

i just bought my second flex buffer. i liked the first one so much i needed another. i got a pe14-3-125. this is the updated version of the vrg3401 that i have had for years. these are not full size buffers. they swing a 6-7" pad instead of the full size 8-9". they are so light. the body is the size of an electric grinder so you can use it one handed. i run these almost all day at least 4 days a week.

compound with wool and 3d aca510. polish with black foam and 3d aca520

overall its a pretty simple process. its the fastest way to go that i have found to date. as with anything though it takes some time to figure out materials. how long to go with each grit and all the little tricks. i have it down to such a science that i can do it almost blindfolded. i dont even have to think about it really. just dont expect that right out of the gate. some guys here can attest to that.
Click to expand...
What brand pads and size do you prefer? I’ve been using a lot of 6 - 6.5” pads lately. And some 3” for tight areas if needed. Getting fancy as I get older.
 
Jim C said:
lake country 6" wool pads on my flex rotary and i use lake country orange and black ccs foam pads after for polish. the foam is 6.5"

lakecountrymfg.com

CCS Curved Edge Rotary Pads - Lake Country Manufacturing

Patented Worldwide. CCS Technology™ Curved Edge pads made exclusively for use on Rotary Machines. Curved Edge helps center the pad on backing plate.
lakecountrymfg.com lakecountrymfg.com
Click to expand...
I’m glad Whitesnake asked and that you specified the pads here. I had been looking at the pads offered on the 3D products page.
At least I was until I looked at the Lake Country page. :oops: 3D had like one wool pad… easy. LC has like 8-10! :eek:
 
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Some guys here say the yellow 3d wool is great. 3d is just silly with the price of it. With the amount i buff i just burn through wool pads like crazy. Buy them a doz at a time. I just cant justify the cost not to mention i dont think they come in 6” which is all i use
 
Jim C said:
Some guys here say the yellow 3d wool is great. 3d is just silly with the price of it. With the amount i buff i just burn through wool pads like crazy. Buy them a doz at a time. I just cant justify the cost not to mention i dont think they come in 6” which is all i use
Click to expand...
The 3D does last a lot longer. Got my first one 5 months ago. Done two completes with it and it doesn't look any different. It's a lot different than a conventional wool pad. It doesn't shed at all so it doesn't look like you murdered a sheep in your Shop. Might even end up saving money over the conventional wool pads.
Only one size though. Believe its around 7".
 
Jim C said:
Some guys here say the yellow 3d wool is great. 3d is just silly with the price of it. With the amount i buff i just burn through wool pads like crazy. Buy them a doz at a time. I just cant justify the cost not to mention i dont think they come in 6” which is all i use
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Yeah I looked at the 3d wool as well. I’m sure it works great. The price was kinda crazy though. And like you I run smaller pads and it’s only available in larger size. I just placed an order a couple days ago for more lake country pads. Wool, orange and black ccs and also force hybrid foam. I also threw in some rupes pads and buff n shine pads. I like to try new things. But boy it all adds up in the shopping cart.
 
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MAKZ06 said:
I remember reading your thread about that. I did a couple small parts by hand using the Sunmight 1000, 1200, 1500, and 3000 foam. I’m optimistic for the sanding phase since it went so well. Very quick and easy, giving a nice uniform cutting/dulling between each grit. I didn’t really see anything happening with the 1200 though so may skip it since everyone else seems to. Although since I have it I guess it won’t add that much time in the whole scheme of things.
The buffing part is what has me worried. I’ve never done it and it seems like that is much more difficult to see or know when you have done enough and when to move to the next pad and compound, etc. I’m going to order the Flex rotary, but I’m still not clear why one of the “forced rotation“ DAs wouldn’t do the job albeit slightly slower. Most of the finishing and detailing forums seem to all push the DAs as beinb the way to go even for major corrections and after color sanding. I wish I had access to both just so I could try it to see the differences.
I saw one of those Lake Country 5 in 1 machines on the local classifieds the other day. That looks interesting but also looks heavy.
Click to expand...
The buffing part is the easy part, the sanding part is the worst part. You might feel it went well but you won’t know until you buff and you see all kinds of sanding scratches still left. I think people will tend to undersand more than oversand.
 
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