Is gloss the same thing as image reflection?

DougS

Promoted Users
I'm new to this forum but have been using SPI products for 5 years or so. I have only done restoration work on the side since the early 80s and have only painted a dozen cars or so but have always used polyurethane clears. Mostly PPG 2002 and what ever the older version was 2001 maybe. My last project was a 70 Chevelle and I used all SPI products except for the polyester primer which was PPG Vibrance line. I used Universal Clear and the image reflection is near perfect but I wouldn't say the car is necessarily "Glossy". My question is Euro 2020 polished to the same level glossier than Universal? Also is there any advantage to shooting Euro unreduced?
 

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The reason I ask is I have seen cars with what I would say have more of a wet look, maybe they were flow coated. Also I'm currently restoring a 67 Chevelle and was thinking of using Euro to avoid some of the work involved in flattening the Urethane wave that the Universal has. I'm not knocking Universal, I'm just weighing my options here.
 
from the pictures it looks great. the only thing i can think of that would be giving you what you are explaining would be you maybe overworked the clear during your buffing process. this will put a surface texture on the clear. it will give you a great gloss but that bit of texture, even though its microscopic will kill that wet look. if you sand your clear and go up through the grits to something like 5000-8000 then keep your buffing to a minimum and keep the heat down from the buffer then you will end up with a much glossier finish. the euro is a good clear but harder to buff out as well.
 
Thanks Jim C, most of the car was trizac da starting at 1500, 3000, 5000 and then only a Flex buffer with 3M perfect it. I'm happy with it and the Universal I was just trying to get a feel for the Euro clear and if on equal terms would be wetter looking due to its hardness? I only paint a car every 3 years or so. So I can only keep up with the latest and greatest through reading and professional painters like yourself. I am a mechanic that has learned to paint out of necessity. Next victim below. Already blocking the polyester primer so wont be long.
 

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sanded and buffed your not going to see a difference between euro and universal. euro does flow a little more but it can be tough to buff out. def more work on that end than universal. out of the gun the euro looks a little better i think.
 
Thanks again, I think I will stick with universal and experiment a little with retarder then to help with the wave. Not that I've had huge issues but it is there. This car will be 76 Corvette Bright Yellow "2756" so probably wont matter as much.
 
Yes totally agree. Urethane wave isnt really the clear as much as it is how its applied. Alot of that comes from the base as well then the rest the clear. If your sanding and buffing then you will get a flatter finish spraying less heavy. Give it a nice orage peel finish rather than getting it to flow out. You can also do 3 coats then sand with 400 an clear again. This will eliminate the wave that comes from the base and it will come out really slick. Also dont be a close sprayer. When spraying clear back off the panel an extra couple inches
 
I agree, from the pictures it looks really nice.

How fine have you polished? If you can in the sun at the right angle see if you have any micro swirls.

About a week ago I fine polished my first paint job. It looked good before, but after an extra step with a fine polish and soft pad it took on a much better look. Any sort of micro imperfection takes away gloss level.

I don't know much about the 3m polishing system, for comparisons sake I used a Black Hexlogic pad, with Menzerna Super Finish 3500
 
I'm not a close sprayer but I am a heavy sprayer, I like to watch the clear fill in, maybe too much. Thanks to Barry I have 140 at the wall and gun (all my compressor can stand) 1/2" hose, TEKNA Pro Light, 1.4, motor guard regulator, 29 PSI trigger pulled fan only. The fan only vs fully pulled always screws with me in peoples post. There are no swirls as I use a flex. I suck at spraying base but feel I do well with clear. Too heavy on base. All my body work and primers sit for days so die back is not really an issue and I follow the Perfect paint job. When you put 2 or 3 years of your evenings in something, you get picky with the result! LOL
 

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I restored a 1986 Monte Carlo a couple years ago and used 3 coats of Euro and waited about 3 days and sanded with 800 then flowed on 4 coats of Universal and the car looks really wet and the clarity is very deep. I just followed what Barry and the other guys here recommended. Your car looks really good and whoever complains about it needs to give it go themselves.
 
Any advice on spraying base would be appreciated, I tend to try and spray it like clear. Maybe I should go 1.3? I tend to stay away from metallic because of this although I have had some success with them.
 
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