I need some expert opinions, please.

mehal

mehal

Member
Hi all,

I just completed my first paint job and I've run into some problems that I need to correct. Its my own truck, a 77 Bronco that I have completely built myself and its been a long process, but I need to get it right as the truck is pretty cool.

I've used mostly SPI products along with a ProSpray base coat in Neptune Blue Metallic. I got the base from Chad's paint. I followed all the SPI instructions and the Perfect Paint Job, but being a newbie, I was bound to have some problems. The first problem I encountered was excessive runs in my (Universal) clear, but I chocked that up to my inexperience and getting used to the gun (Devilbiss GTi Pro-Lite). I wound up sanding most of the panels down again with 600 and then 800 and re-shot the clear. But I did burn through on door edges and a fender opening, so I needed to blend in some base coat again.

Chris Hamilton helped a lot with the blending process, and I thought I had it nailed, but after I re-cleared (from the run issues), I noticed some terrible paint mottling or metallic mismatch, or whatever happened.

Here is the truck and it looks great from a distance:
IMG_2201.jpeg


But here is a view of a side where you can see the color mismatch at the trailing door edge. What kills me is I never noticed it until AFTER the clear had dried, and only from certain angles. The blend looked OK to me when I did it, but because I was shooting over sanded clear, it was hard to tell (with my inexperience) if it really matched. Heres the same door from two different angles.

IMG_2198.jpeg


IMG_2196.jpeg


Here is another shot of a rear fender opening with the same issues:

IMG_2194.jpeg


So can someone help me figure out the problem? Is this a result of the metallics not laying down correctly? Should I have used a blending agent? I added about 10-20% extra SPI reducer so the paint would flow easier - was that a mistake?

I know I will have to sand and reshoot the panels, but I don't want to make the same mistake again. BTW, I still have a few runs in the clear so I will wind up sanding and buffing the whole truck anyway. But it has been a fun experience !

Thanks in advance for taking the time to view and respond. - Mike
 
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I'm terrible at typing long replies, but your first issue is that you didnt fan out your blend enough. It looks like you dead stopped in the area. I know when I blend out I like to go in a diagonal shape down the panel. I feel it helps fool the eye. The added reducer may have attributed to the lighter color you are seeing, or if you didnt tach the panel off good in between coats of base the metallics could have sand piled on you.
 
I have to agree with OJ. Looks like you stopped at a line and didn’t fade it far enough- truck looks small enough that if it were me, I would sand my runs flat and just repaint the whole side . Be careful though- if you sand through the clear you should spot that area in with a little epoxy and let it cure, if you don’t then that paint stands a chance of getting under that fresh clear( where you sanded through) and it will wrinkle it - then you’ll have that issue to deal with
 
Right in a blend spot(which is very short) I see third color lighter and more green than color on the right. Did you use sealer? It's either sealer right in the spot where you did blend or metallic went very dry and gave very light edge.
 
So what happened was this:

1. I sanded the clear on the whole door with 600/800 and then noticed in in a few tiny spots on the edge I saw base and a little primer.
2. So I shot a very thin band of reduced Black Epoxy down the door edge over areas I saw the base/primer.
3. Then I mixed up some base with an extra 20% reducer and sprayed this from the door edge back into the door about 4-6 inches and tried to lift up and/or flick my wrist at the end to feather it out into the sanded clear. I did 2-3 coats of this.
4. I then re-cleared the whole with 3 coats of UV clear.

I then became immensely proud of myself for having just fixed a big boo-boo and thought I was a golden boy. The next day my ego and happiness took a big hit when I noticed what you're seeing in the pics.
 
My first instinct is that you used too fast of a reducer and/or a low quality reducer, you possibly over-reduced it too much, and that combined with technique left you with that dry silvery edge. Also I probably was not good enough at explaining how you fade off at the end of a pass and your fade at the end contributed to the problem areas. (it's a very slight pull-away from the panel combined with a controlled release of the trigger at the same time) Did you keep the base well stirred during this whole process? What speed reducer? What brand? Do you remember what air pressure you had the gun at?

Ok so how to fix it? Quite honestly the safest way would be like Dave suggested above. Carefully sand it with 800, just knock the texture down, don't go through the clear and then re-base it and clear. No sealer necessary. It would not take a huge amount of base, I'd count on two coats.

If you want to try it (blending) again I'll try to explain the process again. But your safest route and probably what I would do if I was in that situation would be to do the sides. It's so short properly blending multiple areas on it is actually more work that doing the side. And by the time you did almost the entire side would have some base on it. With blending it's one thing to explain it to you in person, much harder to explain it and for someone to understand it, in text or even pictures.
 
Hey Chris, I used SPI Slow Reducer, so that's probably not the problem. It was my technique or some other mistep on my part. I will probably shoot the panels over. I assume I should NOT reduce the base again other than the normal 1:1. Is there ever any concern with having too many resprays on a panel? I have already done a few procedures of 3 coats base / 3 coats clear on some of the panels, and this next one will be a third operation of the same.

Granted I sanded down the clear before each operation, but being a newbie I worry about spraying base over (sanded) clear and then more clear on top of that. Might not be a big deal, still learning.

Thanks for the help.
 
Reduce it normally. Millage can be an issue but you should be fine. Only other option is stripping it but is that really practical? I don't think so. Plus you are learning (doing a pretty good job btw) so like everything it's a compromise. I think you'll be fine.

Just make sure you go 800 wet, (safer than 600 wet). Sand in a back and forth motion parallel to the panel lengthwise (front to back). Keep all the scratches going in one direction. Stop and check your progress often. You just want to flatten and remove the texture. Once you have done that stop. Don't sand in one spot more than any other, keep it even.
 
i didnt read this whole thing but i see your metallics are standing up in the very short bleand area. on thing you can do in the future to help a blend is put down a coat or two of clear basecoat/intercoat clear. this way you will be blending onto basecoat. this makes difficult blends much easier.
 
Hi Jim, I'll do that next time and/or if I have to blend again. Right now I'm going to reshoot the whole panel.

I do have some intercoat clear I haven't used yet, so would I just shoot the whole panel with IC clear after 800 sanding down the UV clear and then follow up with the base?
 
Is it really necessary for him to shoot intercoat clear if he’s shootings the whole side(panels) ? I don’t- I just sand my clear and shoot my base since it’s not really a blend- just a re-shoot.
 
I have no experience with blending, I guess I'm a little intimidated by the process. The Bronco looks very nice, what drivetrain are you running ?
 
Its got a 418 ci stroker (560hp 568tq), ZF-5 speed, and Atlas TC.

Suspension is really trick with Fox Coilovers and big Wilwood brakes all around. The rear has a custom 4 link and the front is a combination of long radius arms, custom fabricated steering arms and other parts. Both front and rear are 9-inch diffs (instead of a D44 up front) with 5:86 gears.

Don't even get me started on the body mods....
 
Are those electric actuated running boards in the first picture? Were you able to find them that short or are they custom? I'm finishing up a 74 Bronco for a friend that might want a set of those.
 
mehal said:
Its got a 418 ci stroker (560hp 568tq), ZF-5 speed, and Atlas TC.

Suspension is really trick with Fox Coilovers and big Wilwood brakes all around. The rear has a custom 4 link and the front is a combination of long radius arms, custom fabricated steering arms and other parts. Both front and rear are 9-inch diffs (instead of a D44 up front) with 5:86 gears.

Don't even get me started on the body mods....
Click to expand...
That should feel like a rocket when you mash the loud pedal. Thinking of building a similar combo for a 70 Sportsroof w/ a TKO 600. Very nice execution, thanks for sharing.
 
I would also run maskong tape alone the edges especially since that was your initial issue. Sand the peal out of the panels then remove the tape and go back and carefully finish up where the tape was. I just did my first metallic paint job and feel your pain. I ended up doing this 4 times on the trunk before I was happy.
 
I think a lot of this comes down to technique. I can definitely see the silver dry edge. When I do this I'll start at the bottom and after I cross the area of repair I'll flick my wrist up and out. If you've ever played tennis, to me it's kind of that same motion where you contact the ball and do a quick flick of your wrist. Just in this case, I flick it with an upward motion. As I move up the panel I'lll get to a point in the middle where I stop, then I go to the top of the panel and work down. I am FAR from an expert at this. But that seemed to get me close. Those metallic blues and silvers are tough, though.

Personally, I'd just shoot the entire side since it's only about 8ft long. You can sand that in an hour and be ready to shoot.
 
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