Asking for Recommendation(s) on Clear

L

LuxCar

Hey all,
I've read through some of the posts here about the different SPI clears, but I'm still unclear (no pun intended) as to which clears to use for my various projects.

I used PPG exclusively during the time I was a pro bodyman and painter at a body shop in the 70's to the 90's, but I changed professions and have been out of it for the last 25 years.
I am now retired and about to dig into some of the projects I stored over the years, and I'd like some recommendations for which clear(s) to put on these projects.

#1: A late 90's Dodge RAM 2500 4x4 that needs partial repainting so I want to best match the look of factory paint/clear (Silver base coat). I'll be using PPG factory code silver under the clear for a match to the rest of the truck. As the original owner of this truck, I am greatly and fondly attached to it and will likely be buried in it (that's just a side note :)
So, which clear would do that?

#2: A '75 Corvette Roadster (Steel Blue) that I will be painting complete, also using factory code PPG base coat. When I was in the business, I would typically use Deltron clear and then sand and polish to achieve a lacquer appearance (I fooled many people who thought that my Deltron paint jobs were actually lacquer). I assume that I'll be sanding and polishing whichever SPI clear I use to also look like a lacquer finish.
So, which clear for that?

#3: A 1967 Austin Healey 3000 (aka BJ8) that is factory red. I'll want to use factory code base code on that as well, more to maintain the car's value than anything else.
To be honest, I really don't know how these cars were originally painted, but I suspect they used a single stage enamel or acrylic enamel. My intent whatever they did is to use a factory base coat and then clear with an SPI clear. I suspect that a Euro Clear would be best, but if someone has a recommendation for something else, feel free.
So, which clear for that?

That's my short list if anyone has some specific suggestions.
 
Alright then... I read through the product info for the 4000 clear, and it looks to act a lot like the old DAU82 that used to be my "go to" clear for many years. Having a long term buff time is a wonderful thing.
I've used all of the Ditzler clears and paints, along with Glasurit for the German cars I worked on, but the DAU82 was what I liked the most because it was the most workable and I became quite comfortable with it.

Thanks. I'll be ordering some 4000 soon.
 
You'll be very pleased with all of the SPI products. I used the DAU82 years ago as well, also liked DCU 2001. Universal is a better clear than both of them. The Euro2020 (5000) is also a great product. Perfect for what you want to do to the Dodge. Honestly every SPI product I've used I like. The Epoxy is really the best out there. If you remember PPG DP (not DPLF) it's is a better epoxy than that. And prior to me learning about SPI that was the best one I had used.
 
Chris_Hamilton said:
You'll be very pleased with all of the SPI products. I used the DAU82 years ago as well, also liked DCU 2001. Universal is a better clear than both of them. The Euro2020 (5000) is also a great product. Perfect for what you want to do to the Dodge. Honestly every SPI product I've used I like. The Epoxy is really the best out there. If you remember PPG DP (not DPLF) it's is a better epoxy than that. And prior to me learning about SPI that was the best one I had used.
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It's funny, but I recently went through a fire cabinet I kept from a long time ago to see what I had left from my body shop days. It hadn't been opened
since the late 90's.
Other than a dozen Binks, DeVilbiss, Sharpe and HVLP guns (I loved those old Binks Model 7's), I found an unopened quart of DP40, probably bought about 25 years ago. I'm tempted to mix it up and see what I get, but I'm reasonably sure I wouldn't want to trust it even with some fresh catalyst.

I have to be careful here because I'm afraid I'll lapse into a reminiscing thread, and that's boring for everybody. It was just surprising to see how many memories were jogged while I was going through that cabinet.
 
I suspect the DP used a different formula for the catylist than the DPLF does. Even if it was good, I doubt it would be the same DP we loved 30 years ago when mixed with a new catylist.

John
 
John Long said:
I suspect the DP used a different formula for the catylist than the DPLF does. Even if it was good, I doubt it would be the same DP we loved 30 years ago when mixed with a new catylist.

John
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Totally different, just not with the risk.
 
Personally I think 4000 (Universal) is ideal for hobbyist painting, it's very high solids, fairly easy to spray, and flashes relatively quickly, which helps keep the bugs out. There's really nothing else quite like it that I know of.

This is just my opinion, but I think all the other clears are designed a little more with professional use in mind.

We use Universal on all of our project cars, Euro on the everyday stuff.
 
Technically and historically, I am a pro, so handling clears with different properties doesn't intimidate me.
That said, I do like the idea of the Euro clear except for it's longer flash time. I no longer have access to a controlled booth, so I do have to keep that in mind.
I'm tempted to use the Euro on my Dodge Ram as an experiment since I can at least sand the nibs and polish within the few days it is allowed. As an every day drive, it's not that critical other than I simply want it to look both "nice" and original (the original paint still has that shiny, "flowy" orange peel look like the Euro cars do).

In the end, I do think I'll go with the 4000 for the other two projects.
I do have to order the clear for the Dodge in the next few days so I need to decide soon for the RAM.
 
I hope this thread goes on for a while, to at least see the differences from what you remember to how all these high solid, low VOC paints compare to the old days. Dont know how much if it was considered high solids before. Good old binks number 7 conventional guns were so good, hope you find some parts in a cabinet somewhere to rebuild one of them to use.
 
I have Binks 7 parts stashed as well as an NOS 7 in the box! :D:rolleyes: and a few 7's I keep hanging around. Actually had to use one to spray B/C a few years ago when i couldn't get my sata to behave. It saved the day. Funny how you could tweek that 7 to bail you out of almost any situation.

Lux, I have a feeling we're from the same era
 
The history of my Corvette is that the first owner was upside down on his bank note so our common loan officer called me and asked if I'd be interested in a Steel Blue, '75 A/C Convertible with both tops. I bought it sight unseen, and it turned out to be a really nice car except for the original lacquer paint starting to fade. No damage whatsoever.
It was still box-stock original (it was five years old when I bought it), and I later painted it with base/clear Deltron82 and sanded it and polished it to a lacquer looking finish.
Fast forward, I closed my collision shop and started a whole new career, and shamefully, the '75 got put in my back yard under a tarp for about 10 years. That paint job would have been fine today if it weren't for the outside storage. It's lucky that I did pretty well with my new business so that I could buy some adjacent property and put up another two warehouses, so at that time, I at least could get it inside under roof. Even then, it sat until I retired recently, and it's now one of my retirement projects to restore it (not just paint it).
I'll be stripping off the Deltron down to factory primer and going from there.
I don't expect to have to use a filling primer as I'll finish the base prep with 320 and prime it with DPLF (or possibly the SPI epoxy primer). I'll let that cure for a couple of weeks, then another find sanding and then sealing again with epoxy primer ready for paint.
Then it will going right into Code 27 base coat and clearing with (probably) SPI 4000.
I could post a couple of pics if anyone is interested. Not pretty at this point, though.

My Binks Model 7's were the work horse for most of the painting I did back then, and they're still in great sprayable shape. I'll just replace the gaskets and go from there.
However, I really did get to like my 2-qt pot setup hooked to a Sharpe gun with a finer cap (I'm at home at the moment and don't recall what size it is). It eventually became my go-to setup for spraying clear coats on overalls. I still used the 7's for spraying clear on panel repairs. I also had a 5-qt Binks pressure pot that I used for overalls for a while, but I found that cleaning it up was more of a hassle than it was worth. I ended up selling the 5-qt pot to a friend in the business, but I do wish I had kept it just for grins. I'll carry on using the 2-qt pot for larger clear operations because cranking just a little bit of pressure on the fluid really lets me lay down nice coats. For those who aren't aware, it's not an HVLP setup, it's just a sealed pot that let's you pressurize the paint itself. However, you do get less overspray with that setup because you can cut back on your atomizing pressure and still get a great lay-down of paint.

Slofut, we may in fact be from the same era. I started my collision shop when I was 24 years old in '74 and kept at it full time until I switched over to my other business in '95. It was a small shop, though, and my typical employee compliment was usually between 5 to 10 employees at various times (you probably know how hard it is to find good bodymen and painters, and when they get really good, they leave and start their own shops... at least that's what seemed to be the case way back then.)
 
LuxCar said:
my typical employee compliment was usually between 5 to 10 employees at various times (you probably know how hard it is to find good bodymen and painters, and when they get really good, they leave and start their own shops...
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Still the case cause most shop owners won't pay guys what they are worth, work the crap out of them and still want more. At least every shop that I've worked at has been like that. I'm going to be leaving my job soon. Can't get here quick enough actually.:)
 
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Especially on the corvette, I highly recommend spi epoxy primer and sealer. Just sanded some on my corvette for 7hrs today. Man that stuff is nice, blocks really great with 220 dry. But corvettes are really low to the ground, did the whole front clip, I'm 61 and about beat :D
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I agree with slofut. No comparison between SPI epoxy and DPLF. SPI can be used as a filler primer and sands just as good as 2K. DPLF sands terrible, worse than the real DP, which wasn't good.
 
Someone said they hope this thread will continue on for a while, I have to agree!
There is a lot If good info being posted and statements about employees can help other shops and maybe employees.
 
Chris_Hamilton said:
Still the case cause most shop owners won't pay guys what they are worth, work the crap out of them and still want more. At least every shop that I've worked at has been like that. I'm going to be leaving my job soon. Can't get here quick enough actually.:)
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Exactly the reason I finally left the dealership rat race and opened my own shop 17 years ago. Dealer had 2 downdraft bake booths, 2 prep stations, and a manager that had to run over 400,000 a month before he got paid anything. Had assistant managers(5) for every insurance company that all wanted their car next. I had 4 to 5 helpers and we ran 400- 600 hours a week. I painted all the cars, ordered all the material, wrote all the paint supplements, paid my helpers (one on commission, rest on salary), and dealt with all the managers. I pretty much ran my own business out of their paint shop, made lots of money, and was slowly killing myself. Finally had enough when they started writing HOT or VERY HOT on the windshield of every car and got into it with the manager over a bumper that didn't get painted before I went to lunch( I got it at 9:30 that morning finished in 80#:mad:) I treated all my employees to lunch every Friday, treated them with respect, and paid them all way better than the going rates. I decided to start my own business 17 years ago and it grew quickly, and I've had some really good employees that I paid 50% commission (unheard of these days) on collision and restoration. The pressure was getting to me trying to keep up with the growth, so 7 years ago I moved to a smaller shop, and only have 1 employee besides my wife. I have a list of restorations 2 years long and do smaller wrecks for long time customers and referrals. I don't make near as much money, but I pretty much work on what I want and at my own pace, and probably added a few years to my life.
 
Not trying to turn this into a rant but maybe this can be a heads up for guys looking to make this their profession. For me everywhere I've worked has been the same story, incompetent mangers/owners doing as little as possible, passing responsibility down the chain,, and never ending rush deadlines. I've worked commission at a Shop where they (management) were writing 2 sets of estimates. The actual one, and one for the employees. They would shave 30% or so off the actual estimate when you got the work order. Worked at that place over a year before I found that out. You have to be really careful working commission as I have heard from other guys that is more common than you think. A common theme I've found is dishonesty. Others would call it lying. To the employees, to the customer. Shortchanging the Customer on the repair. Getting chastised when you object to doing that. One Shop I was at Owners wife handled the payroll. She would shave your hours unless you made sure you totaled them yourself and wrote it on your timecard!
I've decided I've had enough. I haven't had a real vacation for over 7 years. I'm almost 47, been doing it fulltime since I left college after 2 years (Lord how I wish I stayed and got my degree:)) I'm not going back to late model collision repair if I can help it. Got enough savings to leave my job and am going to work out of home for a while restoring then selling a car that I have. We'll see how that goes.
 
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