Addressing Orange Peel in Multi-Contoured Panel

Machspeed

Member
Total newb shooting very first panel. I media blasted this gate, did some metal work on it and shot my SPI Epoxy and 2k according to specifications. Leveled everything out and shot my BC/CC this past week. At first, I was pretty proud of it. That is until I took it out into the sun this weekend and found a nasty sag in it and some variance in orange peel. Part of the surface is smooth, while in other areas there is significant orange peel. Assuming poor technique. Complicating matters is that due to the circumstances for which I was painting, I only put two coats of clear on it, albeit they were probably heavy coats. Further complicating issues are the many contours for which will likely give me grief when I attempt to clean up the orange peel with any kind of buffing/polishing equipment, though my knowledge there is limited too and in that I seek guidance.

I saw a couple U-Tube vids on fixing the sag with body filler and I may try that but I’d really appreciate your thoughts on how you would address the overall cleanup of the mess I’ve made here?

Lessons learned:
  • I need more light. Way more light!
  • A newb, this newb at least, must apply more than two coats of clear, as he does not have the skills to apply a smooth even coat of clear.
Thanks Gentlemen, input most appreciated!
 

Attachments

  • Tailgate Orange Peel.jpg
    Tailgate Orange Peel.jpg
    161.5 KB · Views: 295
  • Tailgate Paint Run.jpg
    Tailgate Paint Run.jpg
    98.7 KB · Views: 293
I learned the same things you did, Machspeed. Can never have enough light! And I think I did 4 coats of clear by the time I was done, mostly so I could have good room to cut and buff.
 
Use a silver Sharpie marker as guide coat to highlight the runs, you can see your progress while sanding them flat and most importantly you can see if you're sanding into the surrounding paint- that where burn-through is most likely to occur. Stop sanding as soon as all of the sharpie is gone so you're only sanding enough to remove the run. It's best to wrap a layer of tape over each end of a razor blade and shave down 90% of the run before trying to sand it out. This cuts only the run down without the risk of sanding any surrounding paint. Use aggressive paper (600 grit) on a hard block to sand the rest flat, then work up to a finer grit that buffs easily like 2500+. A soft block will "soak up" the run and let the block contact the surrounding paint, making it more likely to burn through the clear. A hard block with 600 grit, and masking tape over the ends of the block to keep the ends from digging in to the surrounding paint will help cut down only the run.

For the orange peel use the Sharpie the same way but highlight all the edges and inside corners extra to see if you're sanding too much- again, stop sanding in that spot as soon as the sharpie marks are gone. You can cover the whole tailgate with squiggles as a guide coat and sand until the texture is gone.

ADeKxfLh.jpg


TPtlIWzh.jpg


W4QRPnHh.jpg
 
A tailgate like that is probably as hard to spray as any panel there is. It looks great! There are many ways to remove runs, as in the thread Chris posted above. They will all work. As we discussed, you will need more clear to sand and buff anyway, so sanding out the runs will be good practice. If you go through, you can spot the base before reclearing.
 
Hey thanks, gentlemen! In regards to the orange peel, what grit paper would you recommend I start with and how would you address the peel in the recessed areas of the letters? Lastly, thoughts about me successfully removing the peel with just two coats of clear? Think it can be done without cutting into the base?
 
Lastly, thoughts about me successfully removing the peel with just two coats of clear? Think it can be done without cutting into the base?

If it were mine and I only had 2 coats to work with. Id take care of the runs and sand the rest flat with 800 and give it 3 to 4 more coats of clear.

In regards to the orange peel, what grit paper would you recommend I start with and how would you address the peel in the recessed areas of the letters?

 
Hey thanks, gentlemen! In regards to the orange peel, what grit paper would you recommend I start with and how would you address the peel in the recessed areas of the letters? Lastly, thoughts about me successfully removing the peel with just two coats of clear? Think it can be done without cutting into the base?

Cutting and buffing clear coat is something that experience is the best teacher. You only have two coats of clear and you know that some of the clear has flown down the panel and collected into a run. So the layer of clear surrounding the run will be extremely thin. Also, the edges and body lines are notorious for having less clear on them that the horizontal panels.

Everyone cuts and buffs a little differently, using their preferred methods and materials but the concept is always the same.
Think of orange peel as little raised bumps of clear. You need to get those little raised bumps removed and level with the surrounding surface.
Below is my first attempt at removing orange peel on my signature car. This is wet sanding with 1000 grit using a hard block.
Orange Peel.JPG

All the shiny spots are where the sandpaper hasn't made contact yet.
Below I have the clear fairly flat but have dust mark that is still visible. It really starts to get nerve racking as you fear sanding through to the base coat at any moment. This is why everyone advocates for more clear to be applied. This car had 4 coats of clear on it.
Dust mark.JPG

Once the clear is completely flat you will proceed to your next sanding grit which for me is 1500 and then 2000.
Here is a spot where I sanded through trying to remove some of those pesky dust marks:
Fender Sand through.JPG

This required me to learn out to blend paint. Something I had no intention of having to learn and added a bunch more work to a job I thought was almost finished.
Moral of the story: Shoot more Clear!
 
The problem with removing the orange peel with just two coats is that you lose the UV protection from thinning the clear. You need at least two full layers of clear to protect the base. Since you'll have to repaint it anyway it'll be good practice for removing runs and flattening orange peel using the techniques that have been posted. Shoot four coats next time so you have enough material to sand down flat if needed.

For between the letters I'd suggest sanding with 600 to flatten the texture and respraying it; maybe using a slower hardener or reducer so it has more time to flow out for less orange peel. Which clear did you use? From what I've been seeing Euro flows out better than Universal. If you're respraying with four coats then you might not want to add reducer to minimize the chance of die back or solvent pop, so work on your technique and activator speeds to lessen the amount of orange peel.

Or you could sand with 600 to remove the texture and spray one reduced "flow coat" for less orange peel, hopefully without the need for sanding and buffing.

You can also use this to practice wetsanding and buffing. Since there's only two coats, start with 1000 grit and flatten the texture, then work up to 2500-3000. I'd recommend Mirka's white dry guide coat after the initial 1000 grit sanding to make sure you get all of the 1000 grit scratches out with the next step. I usually go from 1000 to 2000 to 2500. After 2500 guidecoat doesn't really stick and can clog the paper so sand with 2500 all in one direction, then if you need to go any finer than 2500 you can sand in the opposite direction and sand until the opposing 2500 grit scratches are gone. Good lighting, clean water (no grit!), clean air (no dust!), and paper that has a uniform grit size is super important- I like Meguiars Unigrit for 2000 and 2500. I've had good luck with a wool pad and Jescar Correcting Compound to take out 2500 grit scratches completely. You'll want a mini buffer for the tight areas on the tailgate, and always keep the edge of the buffer pad that's in contact with the paint directly in line with the body lines and edges (or with the pad's edge spinning off/away from the edge) so you don't burn through as easily. Keep the pad wet with compound and let the compound and pad do the work- not speed and heat. Keeping a bottle of spray detailer will help lubricate and cool the pad and panel so you don't overheat the paint on edges and body lines.

Since you only have two coats to work with this will be a good exercise in removing the absolute bare minimum amount of material in each sanding step, then controlling the buffer to avoid burn through when buffing. If you can successfully keep from sanding/burning through then you'll have a lot more confidence when sanding and buffing 3+ coats in the future.
 
All good advice above and worth doing, if only to gain the experience. But some real world advice, with only two coats and runs in them, you need to sand it down and re-clear and re-base if necessary. Fastest and easiest way to fix the issue. Especially if you are new to this. Anything else you will most likely have issues and spend a lot more time. If you can flatten the runs without going through the clear, great, then you only need to re-clear, but you do need more clear on the panel if you want to cut and buff it. Cut and buffing with two coats then installing the panel (for lack of better wording atm) is a waste of time as your clear will be so thin that clearcoat failure will be inevitable some point down the road. And thin clear does not have the depth of shine that a solid 3 or 4 coats will.
 
Okay fellas, I removed my runs with a razor blade without issue. I then wet sanded the clear with 1000, 2000, and finally with 2500. I have a nice smooth surface with no orange peel. I think it will polish up nicely if I don't burn through. I have a small SPTA Mini Polishing Buffer with an assortment of foam pads from Coarse, Medium, Fine, and Extra Fine. I have access to Mequires products, full line, at the local Oriellys. Can you recommend pad (courseness) and product for polishing this out after 2500?
 
Cut and buffed my tailgate yesterday and was very pleased in how it came out. It's not perfect, but pretty darn good for a total noob, I think! No burn through despite two coats of clear so I'm gonna go with it. Lots learned here in this little project and I'm thankful to those whom offered up the help, not to mention the wonderful products that SPI provides us with.
 

Attachments

  • IMG_0982[1504].jpg
    IMG_0982[1504].jpg
    151.4 KB · Views: 220
  • IMG_0980[1502].jpg
    IMG_0980[1502].jpg
    80.5 KB · Views: 230
Back
Top